The Big Picture

Collider’s Chris McPherson speaks with UFC President Dana White for
Fight Inc: Inside the UFC
.
White discusses the evolution of the sport, the rise of various fighters, and the challenges and rewards of his job.
White also shares his love for finding up-and-coming talent, reflects on memorable fights and events, and discusses Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson’s upcoming film
The Smashing Machine
.

Dana White, the charismatic and often outspoken President of the UFC, has been instrumental in transforming mixed martial arts into a mainstream sport. With over two decades at the helm, White has overseen the UFC’s rise from a niche promotion to a global powerhouse. Recently, he sat down with Collider to talk about Fight Inc: Inside the UFC, a docuseries on Roku that offers a behind-the-scenes look at the inner workings of the UFC. The series has garnered significant attention and Emmy buzz already, and White spoke to me on a hectic day for the company.

Despite a number of problems arising around the time our interview was scheduled — White lost two of his planned main events for UFC’s next big pay-per-view within a matter of hours — he was fun, affable, and very chatty and opened up on why he loves what he does, what he thinks makes UFC so appealing to viewers old and new, the best representation of combat sports in the movies, and his joy at seeing his fighters come from nothing to becoming superstars.

From Niche to Mainstream: Dana White on the Evolution of the UFC

COLLIDER: I loved watching the series. I thought it was a real eye-opener. I’m a bit more of a casual fan of UFC, so I thought it was a really good way of bringing it more to a mainstream audience. The series shows you more behind-the-scenes as a day-to-day businessman, as well as the face of the company. What are some of the tougher parts of your job that people might not know about or see that you think the series might open their eyes up to?

DANA WHITE: The biggest thing is it’s just a sliver, and I mean a sliver, sliver, of what goes on here. We have event ops and consumer products. The biggest group of employees we have here is production. Our production facility here is massive — legal, finance, performance institute, international marketing, brand creative, social, technology. We have our own digital team, we have our own network and flight pass, UFC.com, and we have, like, 562 employees worldwide. We have offices all over the world — Canada, Mexico, Brazil, the UK, Russia, UAE, China, and Singapore. I mean, it’s just a sliver of what really goes on here.

I thought the series did a great job of showing in that first episode how UFC has grown exponentially in popularity over the last decade in particular. Do you think there was one defining moment that flipped the switch for that, or do you think it’s been building gradually and just spilled over into the mainstream as a result of that?

WHITE: Obviously, it’s well known that The Ultimate Fighter is what really launched everything and got people really interested in the sport. Then from there, you have these eras of stars. You go from Chuck Liddell, Anderson Silva, Georges Saint-Pierre, then you go into Ronda Rousey, Conor McGregor, and the list goes on and on. Now, when you look around, we’re in China, we have Weili Zhang, who’s massive there, Alexa Grasso, who’s igniting the Mexican people, Sean O’Malley, who’s become a huge star, Ilia Topuria, who’s from Spain. You have all these different eras, and all these different fighters — Islam Makhachev in the Muslim world, and the list goes on and on.

Image via Amazon MGM Studios

When you mentioned Sean O’Malley there, I thought his story is one of the most compelling parts of the series the way that he emerges. On a human level, do you think it’s just as satisfying for you to find somebody almost from nowhere and turn them into a superstar as it is to put on a massive pay-per-view that breaks records?

WHITE: It’s my favorite thing to do. It’s what I literally love the most about this business. I told you all those different departments that are here. We have 562 employees worldwide, and 412 of them are in Vegas, plus other businesses that I run. What I focus on every day when I come in here is finding up-and-coming talent, putting on the best fights that we could possibly put on, where they’re gonna be, and the in-house live production and the television production. As long as you focus on those key things in this business, because that’s the core of the business, it’s tough to mess it up.

The UFC: Where to Begin?
Image via UFC

For new fans who might watch this and take a new interest in UFC, are there any fights, in particular, you’d direct them to watch? What’s the best card or pay-per-view you think UFC has ever put on?

WHITE: [UFC 300] was just really good. 300 was incredible. The Max Holloway/Justin Gaethje fight is one of the most badass fights you will ever see. But there’s been so many. The thing that makes this sport so great is the things that I just told you that I focus on every day. There’s three types of fight fans: the fight fan that says, “I’m going to the event. I wanna be there,” there’s the guy who’s gonna have the party at his house — get beer, pizzas and whatever, and have his friends and family over — and there’s the guy that’s going to the bar. He’s gonna watch at the bar. They’re all three completely different experiences, but the way that we run our business, the way that we matchmake, the things that we do, nobody walks away from a Saturday night and says, “Yeah, I don’t want to see one of these ever again.” That doesn’t happen with the UFC, and it’s basically because focusing on those major key points, the core of our business, is what has helped make this thing so exciting and fun. So, to tell you one fight to watch is very tough to do because there have been so many good ones.

The thing that you say about putting on so many good fights for fans also makes me wonder, does it make it an easier part of your job to do what you do as a fan of the sport, as much as a businessman, as well? Do you think it wouldn’t be as compelling for you and as satisfying if you didn’t love it at a base level?

WHITE: 100%. You have to love it. I get in here every day between 8:30 and 9 o’clock in the morning, and I don’t leave until 7, 8, 9 o’clock, sometimes, at night. Every single day. So, yes, this business is an absolute monster. It’s a beast. I’m sitting here having this interview with you right now — bad shit is going on here right now. So believe me when I tell you, this business is all about problem-solving and dealing with headaches every single minute of the day. You have to love this to do it.

Well, funny you say that, I wasn’t gonna mention what was going on today, but as much of a nightmare as it can be when shit goes wrong, is it just as exciting for you, as well, to think, “Fuck it, I can actually find a solution to it. This is exciting. I can do something different now?”

WHITE: You’re absolutely right. It is. When you have that perfect event, like 300, it all comes together, and it delivers the way that it’s supposed to deliver. It’s the absolute highest of the highs. Then, in building these cards and working through all the problems every day, and the grind and the this and the that, it’s obviously the lowest of the lows in the business, but those are the parts that I love the most. I love overcoming that. I love finding solutions to problems. I love figuring out puzzles. It’s my favorite thing to do. I’m a sick, demented, twisted person, apparently, and this is what I love.

Hollywood Vs. Combat Sports
Image by Federico Napoli

On our side, at Collider, we are more of an entertainment side of things. From your experience, what do you think the best combat sports films are, especially the ones that portray MMA in the best light? What are your favorites to watch?

WHITE: You know, I have a hard time. I’m so inside, and have done so much in the fight business that when I see the movies, they’re so ridiculous sometimes that I can’t even watch it. But growing up, I was obviously a huge Rocky fan. For a guy who was an actor, [Sylvester] Stallone really did nail a lot of the things that go on in the fight business on every side, from promotion to the fighters themselves to the trainers, to the managers.

He did a great job in nailing a lot of that. What I love about about Stallone’s movies is they’re always very inspirational and uplifting. When you watch a Rocky movie, man, you literally wanna jump out of the chair and go work out as soon as the movie is over. I like movies like that, that try to make you better yourself. Kingdom, [the TV series], was excellent. It was very well done. It was about MMA. If I had to pick one MMA thing that’s been done, I would say Kingdom.

‘The Smashing Machine’ Is an Oscar-Worthy Performance by The Rock
Image via A24

On our site, we’re seeing a lot of interest now in The Smashing Machine, the Mark Kerr film with Dwayne Johnson. Hopefully that accurately represents exactly what it is to be an MMA fighter. Do you think projects like those are the sort of things that will make people want to learn more about the sport too? Dwayne obviously brings a lot of eyes to his projects that might not otherwise know about MMA.

WHITE: I don’t know if you saw it, but he was showing on his Instagram the other day that he messed up his elbow. The Rock will kill this. He will nail this role. I know how serious he’s taking this, I know who’s working with him, and I know how hard he’s working on this film. I think that this could be the opportunity for The Rock to actually be nominated for an Oscar.

We are really excited just to see something different from him. The way he looks in the film is mind-blowing.

WHITE: 100%. He’s taken this very seriously. This has been a passion project for him for a while, and he has 100% of the support from the UFC. Obviously, he’s a friend of mine. This is his chance for an Oscar.

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We just saw UFC featured in Road House with Conor [McGregor] having a good, fun performance in that, but do you think seeing your fighters appear in mainstream projects and movies — Conor and obviously Ronda Rousey was a famous one, as well — is a good way of showing your fighters that, “You do well here. The world is your oyster. You can be whatever you want to be if you fight well for us?”

WHITE: It’s been that way for a long time now. A lot of our fighters have appeared in the movies. I know Max Holloway, Mike Bisping, Cowboy Cerrone, and many others have done it. There are all kinds of opportunities here. When you come into the UFC, and if you get a belt, the world championship is the key to many doors. It opens a lot of doors for you — sponsorship, business opportunities, films, TV. The list goes on and on and on. But yes, I love to see them excel in other things and do things that they like to do outside the sport.

Fight Inc: Inside the UFC is streaming now, in full, on The Roku Channel.

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