In a year of incredible performances, the work of one actress continues to be top of mind. Marianne Jean-Baptiste delivers the performance of her career in Mike Leigh’s “Hard Truths.” It’s a thunderbolt of emotion that is as subtle and nuanced as it is loud. You simply cannot forget it.
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Set in contemporary London, “Truths” is centered on Pansy (Jean-Baptiste), a fiftysomething woman who is unfiltered to a fault. What makes her bluntness so unnerving to everyone around her is how angry and unhappy she is. And whether it’s her husband (David Webber), sister (an equally impressive Michele Austin), or her gregarious nieces, no one can calm her fury. Sadly, her 22-year-old son Moses (Tuwaine Barrett) has been at the center of this storm and become heartbreakingly introverted because of it. Over a few days, Leigh captures Patsy reaching the peak of her emotional pain, and Jean-Baptiste will make you both fear and empathize with her.
In 1996, Leigh and Jean-Baptiste collaborated on one of the filmmaker’s seminal works, “Secrets & Lies.” Jean-Baptiste earned both a BAFTA and Academy Award nomination. Already a Gotham Award and British Independent Film Award nominee for “Truths,” we asked the now longtime Los Angeles resident how she was taking in the Oscar chatter. Is she embracing it or trying to ignore it?
“It’s a bit of both,” Jean-Baptiste admits. “Do you know what I mean? Some of it I kind of filter out and go, ‘O.K.’ But it’s lovely. It’s so nice for the acknowledgment for myself and the film because it’s like the fact that this man still can make films like this, and it’s becoming increasingly more difficult, is just amazing. And I just hope that other actors get to experience working in this way and looking at the result and going, ‘We should be doing more stuff like this.’ We should be having rehearsals factored into all productions. We saved so much time. We went home early every day. We didn’t go over budget. We didn’t go over shooting. I mean, it is such an effective way to work because everybody knows what they’re doing. You’re not trying to find your character or motivation on set. You’ve already figured all that shit out. So all you have to do is get there and shoot it.”
Throughout our interview, the “Without a Trace” star reveals her genuine surprise at how funny audiences saw Patsy, the five-month rehearsal and improvisation process Leigh employs, that Rorschach test of an ending, and much, much more.
This interview has been edited for length and clarity. There are some insinuated spoilers throughout this conversation.
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The Playlist: I saw the movie for the second time last night. I was at the world premiere at TIFF and actually reviewed it. It’s one of the best movies I’ve seen this year, and that’s not hyperbole. I was sort of floored by some of the stuff you were talking about in the Q&A, which I was totally unaware of. But the biggest thing that sort of struck me is that you were unaware some scenes would be funny to moviegoers. Did you not recognize that until you saw it with an audience?
Marianne Jean-Baptiste: I think that Mike has always been aware of it because he’s on the outside watching when I’m in it. I’ve got a monitor that I monitor Pansy and what Pansy is doing. But obviously, I didn’t. I was just like, “Oh my God, she’s too much. This is a lot.” So, I’m sure he was aware of the humor in the situations, but he likes to say that’s life. Life is comic and tragic and people laugh for various reasons, nerves recognition, and all that good stuff. So yeah, I mean, I wasn’t aware for sure.
I constantly hear of actors who don’t like to see themselves on the screen. I think you said you’d seen it twice before.
Oh, no, I’ve seen it six times now.
When you were at that first public premiere, did the laughter freak you out? Did you realize the audience was embracing the movie?
Yeah, I realized that the audience was embracing the movie. I don’t like watching myself at all. And so what’s interesting about this film though, and the same sort of thing happened with “Secrets & Lies,” is you feel like you’re watching someone else, you don’t feel like you’re watching yourself. Some of the things that happened kind of trigger you while you are watching it because you were there living it. But it’s a really sort of different experience from what I’ve had watching other things or looking away at other things that I’ve been in. The first two times that I saw the film, I just felt anxious for her. I think I explained last night that I just kept thinking, “Someone’s going to hit her. Somebody’s going to really hurt this woman.” And then “O.K., but that doesn’t happen. You were there, and you’d have remembered being hit,” but that’s how strong those feelings are and those emotions are when creating the character and the experiences for them.
You mentioned last night that when you worked on “Secret & Lies,” it was a nine-month rehearsal and creative process.
Yeah.
And Mike worked to make this shorter for you this time around, just five months. That sounds like so much to have to experience and deal with for anybody, whether you’re an actor or not. Were you wary about going back into that structure for this project?
Not really. I mean, I was kind of gagging to have a creative experience, a collaborative experience. So, it was kind of like, “Bring it on.” I remember near the end of what was our rehearsal process before we moved into the locations before we started the improvisation that was going to end up on screen. I remember Michelle and I sort of [were] bewildered. We wish we’d had a couple of more months. We were just like, “What are we doing? What is this about? What’s he doing with us?”
Correct me if I’m wrong, but Mike wants to start the process from the beginning of each character’s life. You go through as much of it as you can. Knowing all of Pansy’s backstory, where do you think the inherent pain in her life comes from?
I think the inherent pain comes from this combination of things. It’s fear. I mean, Mike doesn’t like us talking about all the stuff in between because it is about giving the film to the audience and allowing them to imagine or create whatever they create based on their own lives and their own life experience. But I can say this of Pansy, you can imagine a kid that doesn’t go outside or is afraid of going outside, but because she’s a kid that was raised in the seventies in London, it’s like nobody’s going to take their kid off to the doctor and say she doesn’t like going outside. I think there’s a problem. The mom just says, “Just go on, go out there.” And I think she develops the ability to withstand it just like a dog who’s afraid. They start barking, and they start attacking before anybody can come close or anybody can come near. So, I think that’s part of it. I think a lot of her pain comes through the amount of disappointment that was factored into her character. And one of the beautiful things is these two women raised by the same mother have a very, very, very different experience of what that was like. And I think Pansy is one of these people where the glass is half full as opposed to anything else. And her sister’s the opposite.
Can we at least assume that it’s never been as bad as the events in this film? That the intensity of her anguish and her relationships with her son and her husband have reached a fever pitch? Is that correct?
That’s absolutely correct. I mean, we improvised right up until that period of time and then into it. So, things are getting worse. Things are being exacerbated by the time we see her out of bed.
Should we assume that Pansy is aware of all of the pain she has inflicted upon those around her, or do you think she’s nebulous about it?
Oh, she’s nebulous to it. Yeah. For her, it’s necessary to push away and against, yeah, she’s not aware of the pain she causes others.
You also talked about how the cast had a process of coming into the day and then sort of coming out to the day, but did playing this character weigh heavy on you by the end of this experience? Was this mentally exhausting, or was it just a joy to act in something like this?
It’s a bit of both. I mean, there’s a tremendous amount of joy in reuniting with [cinematographer] Dick Pope and the whole crew. But definitely, I think I should have gone on vacation in retrospect, but I came home, and my husband says I brought Pansy with me. I differ. [Laughs.] But yeah, I was exhausted, very much so physically and mentally, and very quiet because I was just fed up talking. She does a lot of talking.
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Do you consider yourself more of a quiet person than the characters you play?
Oh, definitely. Definitely. It’s like the Q&A yesterday. I find things like that really difficult because it’s me. I don’t have a character to get into and whatever. I mean, I’m getting better at it, but yeah.